jumping narrow fences

[Sami Shoaib]

Hi, how do you determine whether its clear or a refusal in terms of the horse jumping sideways? do the legs or just the head have to be on the correct side of the flag? What if you knock flag? Is the jump judge required to tell you whether it was clear or not in these cases?

[carla]

If you clear the jump, but knock the flag it is still considered clear.

[Linda]

Samieventer, am I right in thinking you are asking what if part of the horse goes over the jump and part goes to the side (which could happen if the horse turns side on) and should the judge indicate to the rider whether it was classified as a refusal (in which case the rider should make another attempt before carrying on) or not. (As distinct from the situation where the horse has just clipped the flag and sent it flying, which, as Carla says, is clear.)

Good question - I'd like to know as well.

[Sami Shoaib]

yeah, just at a comp recently my friend had this exact scenario occur, her first event by the wat, the horse jumped and knocked the flag but she was unsure whether he had actuially gone over the jump so she asked the judge who kind of stuttered umm ahh ummm NO, so it seemed like the judge didnt even know. Is the judge supposed to notify the rider of a refusal of this sort, someone said that they should. Its a tricky one.

[Lara]

If you're unsure you should ask the judge if it was clear or not and rejump if necessary. They should be able to give you a clear answer.

If you knock the flag on the inside, it would be clear. But if you are unsure just shout out.

I had this happen to me at SIEC and I had to ask her 3 times, she said yes all three times, just not loud enough, lost me heaps of time, as it was 3 circles later she finally spoke up.

[chicken]

LD is right. It is not up to the jump judge to call out whether it was a clear jump or not - the rider must ask, and can then be given the answer.

So, if you're not sure, just ask!

[vince roche]

This rule is about to be revised in the new 2005 National Eventing Rule (following the same alteration to the FEI Rules):

National Eventing Rules January 2005 Page 35
Run-out
• A horse is considered to have run-out if having been presented at an element or obstacle on the course, it avoids it in such a way that the head and the neck of the horse and the head of the rider when mounted fail to pass between the extremities of the element or obstacle as it is flagged.

Vince

[Linda]

That makes it pretty clear, thanks. Next time I'm jump judging a skinny fence I'll have to remember to position myself so I get a good head on view (could be tricky).