2nd refusal in SJ

[Linda]

When reading the rule book this morning (don't we all, every day) I noticed that for PN and below, you now get 8 penalties for a 2nd refusal and elimination at the 3rd refusal. Is this in line with a change to SJ rules generally or specific to eventing?

[vicki]

The rule change relates specifically to the SJ phase for eventing.

For Intro, Prelim & PN elimination will occur on the 3rd refusal.

For classes * and above there is no change, 2nd refusal is still elimination.

Vicki

[Linda]

When did this rule change? I know we are supposed to familiarise ourselves with the rules, but unless we read them every day, how do we know if we are up to date with the changes? Can rules be changed any time or are there certain dates where changes occur? Would it be possible for Eventing NSW to flag changes on the website in some way?

[vince roche]

It is valid from 1 Jan 2005
It was posted on the EFA Website in mid January.
It is mentioned in the latest Eventer.

It is intended to assist riders in lower classes to give their horses jumping experience .. for green horses, refusals come up pretty easily!

And there is a summary posted each year of changes to both EFA and FEI Rules on the EFA website.

www.efanational.com/content/documents/rules.htm#Eventing

Promise no superfluous comments on wheteher spoon-feeding is necessary!!

[Linda]

I don't know why you think it is spoon feeding us to put something on this website alerting members to rule changes. Not all of us read the EFA website as regularly as this one, and it appeared in the Eventer in March, 2 months after coming into effect.

[vince roche]

Sorry guys. Both myself and the webmaster are actually volunteers and often get busy running our own businesses. It is unfortunate that occasionally these things are overlooked. However, it does pay to keep an eye on the EFA National website. lots of stuff appears there. Vince

[Linda]

Just bringing this topic back up because I've been to 3 ODEs recently where the SJ judge didn't know about this rule change (ie competitors were being eliminated after 2 refusals). Isn't there some way of making sure rule changes get through to the judges out there? The present system isn't working.

[beegee]

I agree with Linda. At Wagga 2 weeks ago they were eliminating Intro riders for 2 refusals. I knew the rule and told one of the riders. She asked the jump judges and they were adamant it was 2 refusals. This competitor payed her entry and though Iv'e never met her she deserved to run X-Country. Shouldn't committees knoe this rule by now?

[Keira]

I had heard about it.. yeah i saw the same thing at Harden... lol typically the rule didnt come in until after the event where i got eliminated for two refusals at the third fence!! lol...
Just one question about this (linking it to harden)... harden had to send out their draw, they also haven't posted results on the internet (anywhere that I can find anyway)... perhaps they can't check the national website?

The officials were really nice and took it on board when people told them it was three refusals (unfortunately the people who had already been eliminated didn't get to try again that I know of).. but they genuinely hadn't heard about it.

[Morgan]

Golly so annoyed...I knew that this rule was the rule, BUT at SIEC midweek I had 2 refusals in the SJ at 2nd and 4th and was going around to go for 4 again and they rang the bell and told me I was elim.
Accepting this, as I thought I must of got it wrong, I left the arena. I know of another rider who had the same thing happen.

WHY did they not know the rule? this is very annoying, as they have changed the rule for a reason and now this little horse has a elim to his name for first event...YES yes yes I know he still may have now got around the rest of the showjump, but at least I would of been allowed to try.

[Simone]

oh morgan is that the one we were talking about the other day shame if it was

[vicki]

There were only 3 eliminations in show jumping, over all classes, at the Sydney mid-week. Judy was not eliminated in the show jumping.

Ours is a difficult sport, we not only have Eventing rules, we also have Show Jumping & Dressage rules that play a part in our competitions.

Our show jumping phase is judged under table A jumping rules.

The 2006 Show jumping rules (not the Eventing rules) include circling rules and gong past the line of the jump rules.

So even though the Eventing rules, for classes PN and below, don't require elimination until the 3rd disobedience,
the disobediences are judged under table A.

Article 219 (FEI rules for the jumping test).

1. The following are considered disobediences and are penalised as such. (1.4 is a new inclusion/change for 2006)
1.1. a refusal
1.2 a run-out
1.3 a resistance
1.4 a more or less regular circle or group of circles no matter where they occur on the course or for whatever reason. It is also a disobedience to circle around the last obstacle jumped unless the track of the course so requires.

Article 222 Run-out (point 3 is an addition/change from the 2005 rules)
1. It is a run-out when the horse escapes the control of its competitor and avoids an obstacle, which it has to jump or a compulsory turning point, which it has to pass.

2. When a horse jumps an obstacle between two red flags or between two white flags the obstacle has not been jumped correctly, the competitor is penalised as for a run-out and he must jump the obstacle again correctly.

3. It is considered to be a run out and is penalised as such for a horse or any part of a horse to go past the extended line of an obstacle to be jumped, or of an element of a combination or of the finishing line or of a compulsory turning point.

If you are eliminated at a competition, there is no reason why you can not politely ask the judge, why your were eliminated. But remember that they are volunteers and have many more competitors to get through while trying to stay to the time table.

I will endeavor to remind all show jump Officials at all Eventing competitions about the specific Eventing show jump rules.

Please ring me if you need further advise.